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Hi there,
opening another thread not to mix things up.

We have found yet another issue we are not sure about. 1st Edition 3.6.2.4. System Encounters says
"An encounter can occur at a fixed defensive point or in deep space. A fixed defensive point may
be a planet or just a base."

And it goes on a little later with
"If a system includes more than one fixed defensive point, only the defenses of one fixed defensive point may be included in a Defensive scenario."

Now we have a system with a planet and a starbase. Are these now 1) 2 fixed defensive points or 2) one fixed defensive point as the planet has the base allocated?

1) If they count as 2 fixed defensive points, then the owner would have to state in 3.7.8 New Construction Deployment which of his fixed defensive points he allocates certain mines and satellites to. However, it does not say so. Plus, in 3.6.3.5 Defensive Scenario it says that you can also include bases to your Task Force so how would that work? In 3.6.3.7. Task Force Creation it says the same.

So it looks as if in a system with a planet and any type of bases, there is

2) only ONE fixed defensive point (by default), the planet. That leads to an issue in creating defensive scenarios. The defender can decide whether or not to include fixed defenses in his task force. Thus, the attacker has no possibility to attack a certain base, be it a starbase or a shipyard. The attacker can only demand a defensive scenario around the ONE fixed defensive point and the defender then builds up his task force. He might until the bitter end just not include his starbases to his Task Force. So we will be seeing an almost empty orbit in the end with a fully intact starbase.

Unless you are using the advanced system rules from the Companion, the planet and starbase are going to be a single fixed defensive point. The only time I would rule otherwise is if you are using house rules that allow ownership of a system to be split between two or more different empires. At that point, each empire would have its own fixed defense point in the system.

I think the only reason 1E's rules tried waffling on this point is because at one point Jay or Byron wanted the rules to be able to cover scenarios where there might be a starbase located at some other predefined location in the system that is other than the inhabited planet. This was before the advanced star system rules existed, and I think they had certain special scenario conditions in mind (like DS9 being at the mouth of the wormhole rather than in orbit of Bajor). It was a vagary that should have been removed from the rules because it only adds confusion for no real benefit.

On the point of #2, as per the YahooGroup ruling, I need to update the errata so that the "MAY include fixed defenses" is changed to "MUST include fixed defenses". I thought I had that verbiage changed but I guess I didn't. You're absolutely right that as written right now someone could just be a complete turd and keep their fixed defenses out of a battle and stare smugly at his opponent until he finally completely loses it and jumps across the table to throttle him.

Tyrel Lohr wrote:You're absolutely right that as written right now someone could just be a complete turd and keep their fixed defenses out of a battle and stare smugly at his opponent until he finally completely loses it and jumps across the table to throttle him.

Thanks for clarifying that, I also had the impression that especially this point could lead to some emotions...